| 00:00:04 | >>> Coming up on the joe behar
showa college student getting
caught having sex on the
rooftop.
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| 00:00:06 | We'll explore the raging
controversy.
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| 00:00:15 | >>> Then, with charlie sheen
making a mockery of addicts and
drew
stops by to set the record
straight on addiction.
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| 00:00:20 | >>> We'll analyze the casey
anthony case.
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| 00:00:24 | That and more starting right
now.
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| 00:00:25 | >>> Hi, everybody.
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| 00:00:47 | I'm laurie dhue sitting in for
joy tonight.
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| 00:00:49 | A student has been suspended
from his fraternity after being
caught on camera having sex with
a woman on the roof of the
building on campus.
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| 00:01:04 | One of its members wrote a very
manifesto describing girls as
sexual targets and rating their
skills.
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| 00:01:07 | Is fraternity culture on campus
getting out of control?
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| 00:01:21 | Joining me to discuss this is
tucker max, author of "i hope
they serve beer in hell" and
a-holes finish first.
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| 00:01:31 | Classy.
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| 00:01:33 | Lisa bloom, founding partner of
the bloomfirm.com.
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| 00:01:36 | Great to see you.
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| 00:01:38 | >> Thank you, laurie.
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| 00:01:40 | >> The blog goss fear is going
nuts.
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| 00:01:43 | I hope the trojans we're using
tro januarys and surely there is
something more news worthy than
this.
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| 00:01:56 | Everybody is talking about it.
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| 00:01:57 | Lisa, isn't this just what
college kids do?
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| 00:01:58 | >> Well, look, I don't care if
consensual adults are having
something and I'm assuming they
are both over the average of 18.
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| 00:02:10 | The problem is the generation
engaging in risky behavior, it
gets caught on tape and can ruin
your reputation forever.
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| 00:02:18 | Those pictures are out there,
they are not going away, and the
ones on the internet don't have
that nice little red ribbon.
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| 00:02:23 | That's the problem.
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| 00:02:27 | This generation has to be even
more careful than my generation
was when we were streaking and
mooning.
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| 00:02:41 | >> Tucker, it seems to me that
these people obviously wanted to
be seen.
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| 00:02:43 | It seemed like they planned the
whole thing.
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| 00:02:44 | It had something at eye level to
take pictures of the whole
thing.
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| 00:02:47 | What's your take on this?
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| 00:02:48 | I can't wait to hear.
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| 00:02:49 | >> Well, my understanding, too,
is that they did it during a
fill lan tlop pea event when
there was a bunch of other
people underneath.
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| 00:02:57 | That's part of the humor and
thrill, the discovery.
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| 00:03:00 | I don't see what the big deal
is.
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| 00:03:03 | So what if their pictures are on
the internet.
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| 00:03:05 | They made that decision.
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| 00:03:07 | They can live with the
consequences, both positive and
negative.
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| 00:03:09 | It's their lives, not yours.
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| 00:03:12 | >> You don't think there's
something more sinister at play
here, sort of the propelling
forth that women are objects?
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| 00:03:19 | >> No.
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| 00:03:20 | Look --
>> I'm just throwing it out
there.
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| 00:03:28 | >> Young men do stupid things
and young women do stupid
things.
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| 00:03:33 | It's part of how you learn.
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| 00:03:34 | By what you're doing is what you
shouldn't be doing.
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| 00:03:43 | That's what they are doing.
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| 00:03:44 | That's what college is about.
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| 00:03:45 | It's not a big deal at all.
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| 00:03:46 | >> A-holes finish first, right?
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| 00:03:46 | I mean, people are engaging in
this behavior but I have two
kids in college, one of them is
a girl, and I talked to her and
a lot of their friends and they
say that they see the hook-up
culture as destructive to girls.
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| 00:03:57 | Guys get whatever they want.
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| 00:03:58 | They can get the quick hook-up
or the relationship but girls
feel stuck in this world where
in truth they want a boyfriend
and it's hard to get one because
guys get the hookups.
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| 00:04:10 | If you go up on the roof with
the guy, you can have a little
fun but you're not going to get
the relationship, which is what
most girls are looking for.
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| 00:04:15 | >> What happened to personal
accountability?
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| 00:04:17 | I once was in college and I'm
not saying I engaged in this
particular type of behavior but
I know plenty of people who had
sex in public.
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| 00:04:27 | So I'm not trying to sound like
somebody's mother here.
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| 00:04:30 | But it makes you wonder, tucker,
what is happening here?
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| 00:04:35 | >> I don't understand.
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| 00:04:36 | I don't think there's any
problem or conflict.
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| 00:04:38 | If you want to have a boyfriend,
there's a simple way to do that.
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| 00:04:41 | Only date guys.
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| 00:04:45 | They are easy to avoid.
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| 00:04:46 | They are easy to spot.
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| 00:04:47 | Clearly that girl on the roof
had no problem.
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| 00:04:49 | >> It's not easy, though.
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| 00:04:50 | >> Yes, it is.
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| 00:04:52 | It's simple.
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| 00:04:55 | >> No, because if you're in a
culture where this is what all
of the guys want --
>> I mean, come on, really?
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| 00:05:04 | I mean, really.
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| 00:05:05 | On one hand you say what
happened to personal
accountability and on the other
hand you're saying, but they
can't help it, they are forced
into this situation.
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| 00:05:12 | You have to pick a side of the
road.
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| 00:05:14 | That's total bs.
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| 00:05:15 | >> I want to show you --
>> I didn't say anybody was
forced into it, tucker, but
there's a certain culture that
the girls find very oppressive.
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| 00:05:23 | >> Then don't be involved in
that culture.
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| 00:05:26 | >> This is really the only
option for them.
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| 00:05:29 | >> Hang on one second.
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| 00:05:30 | I want to read this statement --
guys, just for a sec, I want to
show you what the president had
to say about this and then hear
is his quote, we in no way
support this kind of behavior,
nor do we promote any other such
actions.
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| 00:05:53 | The member in question has been
suspended from kappa sigma for
conduct unbecoming -- isn't this
the kind of behavior
fraternities are known for?
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| 00:06:01 | >> I wasn't even in a fraternity
in college.
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| 00:06:02 | I don't want to be the spoke man
for frats, either positive or
negative.
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| 00:06:11 | They are saying this because
they got in a lot of trouble a
couple of weeks ago for an
e-mail and they don't want to
get distanced or kicked out for
their national organization.
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| 00:06:20 | What do you expect them to say?
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| 00:06:25 | That this is really funny?
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| 00:06:25 | He's not going to say that.
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| 00:06:26 | >> It seems like a joke.
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| 00:06:27 | Conduct unbecoming.
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| 00:06:29 | He's going to be punished.
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| 00:06:30 | >> It is.
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| 00:06:32 | >> This guy is not going to be
punished.
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| 00:06:36 | >> I mean, the school might
punish him.
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| 00:06:38 | >> By the way, we should have
fairness here, no double
standards.
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| 00:06:41 | If he's punished, I don't know
why the girl isn't, too.
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| 00:06:44 | Because apparently they are
engaging in consensual sex.
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| 00:06:50 | >> She is not a usc student, at
least according to reports out
there.
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| 00:06:53 | She was a willing participant in
this whole thing.
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| 00:06:54 | >> Yeah.
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| 00:06:57 | >> But lisa, let me bring up
something.
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| 00:07:00 | There's something called
eduhookup.com.
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| 00:07:02 | And this is the website
facilitating sex.
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| 00:07:13 | Not for dating or finding a
boyfriend or girl friend, it's
for looking up and that's that.
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| 00:07:16 | What about blaming the internet?
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| 00:07:22 | Is it legitimate to -- are you
going to walk off the set or
stick around?
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| 00:07:25 | >> No, but this is comical.
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| 00:07:28 | I thought these conversations
were done in 2002.
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| 00:07:31 | >> Well, sorry.
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| 00:07:32 | >> This is something -- if i
could just respond to this, this
is really a concern to college
women.
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| 00:07:38 | And it might be funny to tucker
and a lot of guys, but it's more
about two people that consent to
sex.
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| 00:07:44 | But there's a real culture where
girls feel like they are not
getting what they want and
there's a culture where they
feel that either they get a
hookup or they get nothing.
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| 00:07:53 | They get a hookup with a guy,
which we means sex with them,
hoping that they get another
relationship because I think
males are maturing slower than
females.
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| 00:08:06 | The internet is only encouraging
that by those kinds of sites
where guys are getting more
hookups and girls are getting
more frustrated with the
culture.
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| 00:08:18 | >> Tucker, you've sighed a lot
since you started this segment.
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| 00:08:19 | >> This is arguments that is
preposterous.
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| 00:08:26 | Adult friend finder started
years ago.
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| 00:08:34 | People have been finding --
classified exists for years.
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| 00:08:40 | >> But now there is a website
for it.
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| 00:08:43 | >> People have been looking up
just to hook up.
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| 00:08:47 | That's why bars existing, okay?
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| 00:08:49 | The internet that it is creating
this is so ridiculous and
purpose sister rouse, I feel
like I'm talking to people 20
years ago.
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| 00:09:00 | >> I'm sorry you feel that way.
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| 00:09:00 | Gosh.
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| 00:09:07 | >> Nobody said that the internet
created it.
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| 00:09:08 | What I'm talking about is a
culture that a lot of women
complain about.
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| 00:09:10 | If you talk to girls in college,
many of them will tell you they
are really dissatisfied with
that culture.
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| 00:09:21 | >> I promise you I talk to more
girls in college than you do.
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| 00:09:29 | There's a simple solution.
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| 00:09:30 | Don't be involved in it.
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| 00:09:30 | There are plenty of guys --
>> don't go to college?
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| 00:09:36 | >> Don't be part of that hookup
culture.
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| 00:09:51 | >> I'm going to take that advice
to heart now because earlier i
was going to hookup websites and
now I'm not going to.
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| 00:09:55 | Thank you very much.
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| 00:09:56 | Tucker max, lisa bloom, great
discussion.
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| 00:09:57 | Thanks for that.
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| 00:09:58 | We'll be right back after this.
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| 00:12:59 | >>> Trial time is nearing for
casey anthony accused of
murdering caylee anthony.
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| 00:13:03 | Now, a lot of circumstantial
evidence is making up the
state's case against casey but
her defense team appears to be
working every single angle to
help the accused murderer before
the trial starts in early may.
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| 00:13:21 | There is a news report that says
that casey's defense team has
billed the state of florida over
$100,000 for their efforts.
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| 00:13:29 | Joining us to discuss all of
this, stacy, florida prosecutor,
and on the set with me in new
york, midwin charles.
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| 00:13:32 | Stacey, $100,000 now billed to
the state of florida, it seemses
outrageous to me.
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| 00:13:40 | What is your take on that?
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| 00:13:53 | >> I'm sure that the people who
live in the state of florida are
outraged about that but you're
dealing with a high-profile
first-degree murder case.
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| 00:14:06 | While it seems to be so, so high
to the general public, the
bottom line is, when you start
feeding these experts and they
have to testify and come in and
review and generate their own
reports, this is the type of
financing that you're talking
about.
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| 00:14:19 | So to me being in this business
it doesn't sound so outrageous
for a case of this magnitude.
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| 00:14:28 | >> Okay.
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| 00:14:29 | Let's move on and talk about the
recent speculation that casey's
defense may try to pin the
murder on casey's father george.
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| 00:14:33 | Now, george's attorney caught
wind of this potential strategy
and released a statement.
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| 00:14:36 | Let's show you that statement
now.
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| 00:14:37 | George anthony had nothing to do
with the death of caylee marie
an anthony.
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| 00:14:45 | He's been examined by both sides
and neither have maintained that
he is in any way at fault.
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| 00:14:50 | Midwin, it seems like they are
reaching here.
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| 00:14:54 | What on earth are they trying to
do by blaming it on her father?
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| 00:14:58 | >> Throw everything and see what
sticks.
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| 00:15:10 | After all, this guy has never
been arrested and they don't
have any evidence or facts to
back any sort of claim that he
had anything to do with her
disappearance.
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| 00:15:15 | >> You think grasping at straws
here, just trying to smoke in
mirrors to get the attention
away?
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| 00:15:19 | >> Perhaps smoke in mirrors.
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| 00:15:21 | But you don't want anybody to
laugh at you.
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| 00:15:24 | After all, it has to pass the
laugh test.
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| 00:15:27 | I think what they ought to do is
focus primarily on the
scientific evidence because it's
going to become a battle of the
experts.
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| 00:15:35 | >> And we're going to turn to
that in a minute.
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| 00:15:38 | Stacey, real quick, the defense
is going to try to show that he
was abusive and that the suicide
attempt showed that he was
guilty about the whole thing.
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| 00:15:44 | Could blaming her father
actually work?
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| 00:15:46 | >> Absolutely not.
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| 00:15:48 | It's theater of the absurd.
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| 00:15:50 | There is no evidence linking him
in away, shape, or form to this
murder and, bottom line is what
you said, it's called grasping
at straws.
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| 00:15:58 | There's a ton of scientific
evidence and a lot for the
defense to overcome and so
that's what you start doing.
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| 00:16:04 | You start placing the blame on
other people.
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| 00:16:06 | It's not going to fly in this
case at all.
|
| 00:16:13 | >> Let's talk about the science
of the case.
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| 00:16:16 | Casey's lawyers are now moving
to strike certain experts from
the witness list.
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| 00:16:21 | One who examined hair found in
caylee's trunk of the car,
another expert who examined
plant growth around where the
little tiny body was found.
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| 00:16:28 | How come, stacey?
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| 00:16:32 | Do you think it will work?
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| 00:16:35 | >> Well, that's primarily what
the defense's job is.
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| 00:16:39 | This is expert scientific
evidence.
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| 00:16:43 | While it's novel and new, the
judge has to decide if it's
accepted in the scientific
community.
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| 00:16:51 | That's the hearings that they
are going through right now.
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| 00:16:54 | It's crucial for the
prosecution.
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| 00:16:57 | While it won't make or break the
case, it's certainly lends
itself some expertise in whether
or not the body was where it --
where they said the body was,
whether or not there was
chloroform in the trunk.
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| 00:17:15 | All of these little pieces of
the puzzle is what the jury is
going to want to hear and
scientific evidence is the best
thing to go with with that.
|
| 00:17:18 | >> You're nodding your head.
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| 00:17:19 | >> This case is circumstantial.
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| 00:17:20 | No one saw her do anything to
this little girl.
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| 00:17:23 | So the prosecution really is
facing an uphill battle in the
sense where all they have are
these sort of facts.
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| 00:17:30 | Or the claim that there was
perhaps chloroform, and the
remains of the body and what
sort of -- how long did it take
for the little grass under the
body to grow, thereby trying to
show, how long was the body
there?
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| 00:17:49 | That's all they have to go on in
this case.
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| 00:17:53 | >> Casey's parents are both on
the record saying that casey's
trunk of her car smelled like a
dead body.
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| 00:17:56 | I want us to listen to cindy
anthony's 911 call from a couple
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